Classical Music & Opera Forums

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 10:14

Pavvarrotti

I am listening to him as I write. I find his voice, its gorgeous but unchanging timbre grating after a few minutes of listening. It becomes boring to me. Can a voice be too even? P's voice sounds very much the same at different levels of pressure and all along its range, except when he does one of his phony ppps.

I prefer a voice like Jussi's that has a baritonaL bottom, a rich middle and ringing tops with many variations of timbre in all ranges.

calvert · by **calvert** on 12 May 2009, 10:28

When Pavarotti is at his best (as he was for that Puritani broadcast in 1976), his singing is, to my ears, filled with light and shade and not monochromatic or monotonous at all. Actually, I find Bjoerling's timbre more unvarying than Pavarotti's, but the sound is so stupendous and so sheerly gorgeous, and the musical imagination behind it so potent, that I never find him boring.

But yes, Pavarotti's pp's were often (not always) a kind of faked, breathy crooning; not the best feature of his voice and one that got worse as the years went on. Still, he could do some loverly mezza-voce singing.

I generally had bad luck with Pavarotti in performance (I heard him a lot at the Met); he usually cracked, or came close to cracking, on at least one high note every time I heard him; the Puritani performance was a glorious exception. Actually, at the second performance I saw of Puritani later in that 1976 run, Pav was cracking all over the place. On the unison high D with Sutherland in "Vieni, fra queste braccia," Pav's high note turned into a ghastly croak, and he immediately hid his head behind Sutherland's big red bouffant hairdo and let her carry the sound. It was really funny. But then, he nailed the high D a few minutes later in "Credeasi misera."

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 10:40

calvert wrote:When Pavarotti is at his best (as he was for that Puritani broadcast in 1976), his singing is, to my ears, filled with light and shade and not monochromatic or monotonous at all. Acdtually, I find Bjoerling's timbre more unvarying than Pavarotti's, but the sound is so stupendous and so sheerly gorgeous, and the musical imagination behind it so potent, that I never find him boring.

But yes, Pavarotti's pp's were often (not always) a kind of faked, breathy crooning; not the best feature of his voice and one that got worse as the years went on. Still, he could do some loverly mezza-voce singing.

I generally had bad luck with Pavarotti in performance (I heard him a lot at the Met); he usually cracked, or came close to cracking, on at least one high note every time I heard him; the Puritani performance was a glorious exception. Actually, at the second performance I saw of Puritani later in that run, Pav was cracking all over the place. On the unison high D with Sutherland in "Vieni, fra queste braccia," Pav's high note turned into a ghastly croak, and he immediatly put his head behind Sutherland's big red bouffant hairdo and let her carry the sound. It was really funny. But then, he nailed the high D a few minutes later in "Credeasi misera."

I guess we all hear differently, especially regarding timbre. I heard P only a few times, in Puritani, Fille (the early one), Boheme and Rigoletto-maybe one other, Ballo?-- and was never that thrilled. I saw Bjoerling an equal number of times in concert and at the Met and was in heaven!

manh1948 · by **manh1948** on 12 May 2009, 10:44

Calvert

Like you, I saw Pav. many times as my return to the US and subsequent opera going was during his heydays. I think his Puritani with Sills in Phila. is among the greatest and most exciting singing of any tenor ever.

Lauritz · by **Lauritz** on 12 May 2009, 10:54

manh1948 wrote:Calvert

Like you, I saw Pav. many times as my return to the US and subsequent opera going was during his heydays. I think his Puritani with Sills in Phila. is among the greatest and most exciting singing of any tenor ever.

I agree about that Puritani with Sills. I have it on CD and he is at his greatest. Not that she was bad either.

kashania · by **kashania** on 12 May 2009, 10:58

Lauritz wrote:
manh1948 wrote:Calvert

Like you, I saw Pav. many times as my return to the US and subsequent opera going was during his heydays. I think his Puritani with Sills in Phila. is among the greatest and most exciting singing of any tenor ever.

I agree about that Puritani with Sills. I have it on CD and he is at his greatest. Not that she was bad either.

I third that notion! He is simply glorious in that live performance.

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 11:05

kashania wrote:
Lauritz wrote:
manh1948 wrote:Calvert

Like you, I saw Pav. many times as my return to the US and subsequent opera going was during his heydays. I think his Puritani with Sills in Phila. is among the greatest and most exciting singing of any tenor ever.

I agree about that Puritani with Sills. I have it on CD and he is at his greatest. Not that she was bad either.

I third that notion! He is simply glorious in that live performance.

I guess I am in the minority concerning P. Ya can't like everyone?? :shock:

manh1948 · by **manh1948** on 12 May 2009, 11:13

Pavarotti Philadelphia Puritani Paragon Performance 8-)

I have only a pirated tape of that performance. Is the CD a broadcast or an official in-house recording?

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 11:13

To change the subject: Simionato on Callas from S. Zucker on opera-l

http://listserv.bccls.org/cgi-bin/wa?A2 ... m&P=143894

kashania · by **kashania** on 12 May 2009, 11:51

manh1948 wrote:Pavarotti Philadelphia Puritani Paragon Performance

I have only a pirated tape of that performance. Is the CD a broadcast or an official in-house recording?

I recorded one of La Cieca's old podcasts of this but I'm sure it exists on CD. I hope so because I'd like to buy it myself.

kashania · by **kashania** on 12 May 2009, 11:53

Amni: Very interesting interview with Simionato. I didn't realise that she and Callas were so close.

Lauritz · by **Lauritz** on 12 May 2009, 12:01

manh1948 wrote:Pavarotti Philadelphia Puritani Paragon Performance

I have only a pirated tape of that performance. Is the CD a broadcast or an official in-house recording?

I also have the pirated tape, but the CD I have (I don't recall from where) is the identical live performance With the high note at full throat--not the half-voice of the commercial version with Sutherland.

mogliettina · by **mogliettina** on 12 May 2009, 12:20

amneris wrote:Pavvarrotti

I am listening to him as I write. I find his voice, its gorgeous but unchanging timbre grating after a few minutes of listening. It becomes boring to me. Can a voice be too even? P's voice sounds very much the same at different levels of pressure and all along its range, except when he does one of his phony ppps.

I prefer a voice like Jussi's that has a baritonaL bottom, a rich middle and ringing tops with many variations of timbre in all ranges.

Bingo!

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 12:20

kashania wrote:Amni: Very interesting interview with Simionato. I didn't realise that she and Callas were so close.

The story about the poisoning is very weird.

mogliettina · by **mogliettina** on 12 May 2009, 12:26

"The story about the poisoning is very weird."

Uh ... VERY!

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 12:26

Meistersinger (a totally gorgeous opera!!!!)from 2001 is now on Sirius. I am not crazy about Morris' Hans Sachs. Heppner sounds great, but you can tell he has problems with the top--he almost cracked once. I always wince when he goes up there although most tops come out just fine. I do love the sound of his voice.

amneris · by **amneris** on 12 May 2009, 12:29

mogliettina wrote:"The story about the poisoning is very weird."

Uh ... VERY!

That story would make a good one act opera, "Il Veleno"!

Starring Callas and Simionato, of course.

Today they could do it with Nebs and Garanca! With Blythe as Callas' mother! :lol:

karlhenning · by **karlhenning** on 12 May 2009, 12:58

amneris wrote:The story about the poisoning is very weird.

Katya has some mushrooms ready for her father-in-law . . . .

Cheers,
~Karl

kashania · by **kashania** on 12 May 2009, 13:32

Well, he did ask for them.

calvert · by **calvert** on 12 May 2009, 17:37

One more thing about that Puritani broadcast today: James Morris had a drop-dead gorgeous lyric bass voice before he got into Wagner. One would never guess, listening to him sing "Cinta di fiori," that one was hearing the future premier Wotan of his generation. One of the special things about Morris' heldenbariton singing, at least before the years began to take their toll and the vibrato loosened into a wobble, is that he took that beautiful bass-baritone sound into a rep where vocal beauty is by no means a given.

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